Arizona Premier League 2019 and beyond!

Discussion in 'Arizona Scene' started by aginaz, Jun 18, 2019.

  1. al66

    al66 New Member

    Yeah, I agree that less than half the ‘08 RSL DA team will come within the club. Which makes me wonder what the point of merging with all these clubs if you’re not going to choose from within the club. Doesn’t look good
    Galazkiewicz likes this.
  2. aginaz

    aginaz Active Member

    2006 Girls DA had a similar experience this year - with just a small handful of girls coming from RSL's "top" team and the remainder from elsewhere. Most of that "top" team ended up on their DPL team.
  3. tjinaz

    tjinaz Member

    That 06G DA also pulled 3 from RSL 07G top team. Not sure if they are staying 06 next year or will go back to 07 team.
  4. Tiki-Taka-Freak

    Tiki-Taka-Freak Active Member

    Is there anyone out there who agrees with me that starting DA for the 08's is a little too young? I know DA is pretty rigorous, there is travel time, and it can be costly. Burnout is a real thing. Trying too juggle soccer and school together with the schedule these kids endure can be too much for them. When it starts to count like ages 16+ they won't have the passion to play anymore because it feels like work. All that time and energy is for nothing at that point.
  5. Sweeper

    Sweeper Active Member

    100% agree. I don’t think too many 08’s are playing DA but parents push their player to DA too early. By the time those players are 16/17 years old and juniors in high school, they want to quit the sport.
  6. Give&go

    Give&go New Member

    I’d add that even the schedule of some of the pre-DA teams are crazy. Practices all summer, 4x a week and a bunch of travel. You start to question when you see injuries piling up on 11-12 year old kids. I could see burnout being a big issue here down the line.
  7. GKdad

    GKdad Member

    06G Del Sol DA has at minimum 3 07's as well..
  8. Desert Hound

    Desert Hound Active Member

    Actually that is not what I see at all. The ones there at 16+ are the ones that have been good for some time and continue to have a passion for it.

    By and large the only ones I have seen leave were ones who were good at younger ages, but didnt continue to develop and get better.
  9. SoccerDadAZ

    SoccerDadAZ Member

    The intent of the Development Academy is to focus more on player development and avoid burnout, injuries, etc. More training and less on games/tournaments (4:1 ratio) or rather a focus on game quality vs. quantity. Games and tournaments are the bigger reason for injuries, burnout from an overemphasis on results, and cost to the family. Yes, players at an older age drop out at the highest levels due to an inability to compete at that level. But the time and energy spent in youth soccer and team sports for most kids is well spent: friendships created for a lifetime, families spending time together, fitness, learn the value of hard work, practice, and discipline. Better to try and fail than to never try at all....
    Desert Hound likes this.
  10. whatithink

    whatithink Active Member

    That sounds a bit like a marketing blurb for DA - and most definitely Kool-Aid like.

    GDA is US Soccer seeking the 0.1% (or less) of kids who might make the USWNT. They can control it, unlike ECNL.

    GDA train 4 times vs 3 for ECNL, that's more.
    Both do one game per day.
    2 leagues dilutes talent in each and therefore reduces quality in both, so lots of dead rubber games.
    Sub rules in DA drive more play time for the few, versus ECNL can have more for the many.
    Results never seemed to matter in ECNL, it seemed as hard to get kicked out as it was to get invited in!

    It seems to me that there is room for both in the soccer landscape and in AZ we're fortunate to be able to choose, if your DD is good enough, and so can make the right decision for your family, e.g. HS anyone or if your kid is not a starter they will prob get more time in ECNL given the more generous sub rules vs. in Region 4 DA prob has the stronger teams at the top end so if its playing the best then do DA.

    How good DA is for your DD, is dependent on the club/coach/team - same as ever.
    Give&go likes this.
  11. SoccerDadAZ

    SoccerDadAZ Member

    Whether you think it's a marketing blurb for DA or not is beside the point. My original comment was that the overemphasis on games, tournaments, and results is the bigger reason for injuries and burnout for a lot of players. The fact is DA, Boys and Girls, philosophy is to focus much more on training and less on the games. I'm not sure how ECNL was brought into the thread but it's definitely another path for players to choose from.
  12. whatithink

    whatithink Active Member

    Boys & Girls DA are entirely different as the end goal is entirely different for the particpants, i.e. Boys dream of a prof career which you can do without being a unicorn and earn a good to great living. The fall back is a college scholarship. For Girls its a scholarship or college ball.

    US Soccers objective is competitive NTs for MNT & WNT, so identifying the elite of the elite. Ideally they want them to compress into elite of the elite teams in an elite of the elite league, or should. MLS will do that on the boys side and are making moves that way. US Soccer will have to force that on the girls side, possibly through NWSL if it survives and over which they have control. There will be tier 1 & 2 etc., already starting on the boys side, with MLS/NWSL in tier 1 and the rest as feeders. That makes complete sense.

    As for the philosophy piece, yeah whateves … the only way to assess the quality of training is in competitive games vs other teams.

    I agree that the number of tournaments clubs have teams play is silly, not least as the tournaments have zero concern for player welfare with 2 games per day, 3 games in 24 hours, 6 games in 3 days … that nuts and a recipe for injurys.

    Kid burn out seems over used to my mind. I would expect behind the kid burn out is a kid that's lost interest, was never interested, is sick & tired of random parent reliving their youth through their kid, is sick & tired of the parent talk on the way home in the car etc. You also have kids getting into HS sports, parent tired of shelling out $ for what with college coming etc. In short, there's a wide and varied range of reasons kids stop playing - "burn out" to me is a lazy catch all and prob only true in a minority of cases.

    I mentioned ECNL above to compare to GDA, as it was/is extremely successful, produced players who have won multiple world cups, include the last one - but has a different approach, right/wrong … I guess we'll see in 10 years maybe.
    aginaz likes this.
  13. Tiki-Taka-Freak

    Tiki-Taka-Freak Active Member

    I agree with everything said except burnout. No matter what sport you are in playing in leagues such as DA or ECNL does pay a toll. Having to juggle school and soccer together while sacrificing personal time does have an impact on psychology of youth atheletes in my opinion. I can only speak for myself, but I have been in conversations with parents on this issue. They will often say their kid used to practice in the backyard, study professional games, and talk about soccer all the time. They do not do those things anymore. The fun has been zapped away from them. I have a friend whose daughter was a very good basketball player and was on a traveling team. The workload got to be too much so she quit. She was relieved that she had a life again. Now, I am sure there are kids that do just fine in those leagues. There has to be a balance though. Even the pros have a break for a couple of months or so.
  14. Youtube guy

    Youtube guy Member

    Anyone else pay attention to the 06 APL this weekend? I saw that Classic 06 Sanchez tied Del Sol 1-1 but prior, the Sanchez team lost to Classic Putrell 2-1 then Classic Putrell looses to Del Sol 7-1. I was expecting Del Sol to beat Classic Sanchez pretty easily. Del Sol missing players? Also CCV 06 looks hit or miss. I hear their goalie only wants to play half the game in the net, the other half in the field. That RSL Bermudez team should have asked for SL2 instead of APL. Will they get their DA players back next season or will those boys stay at RSL north and play ECNL?
  15. Desert Hound

    Desert Hound Active Member

    RSL and del Sol care about and want DA.

    Right now they have it at the very younger years. RSL also has ECNL. Those 2 leagues (depending on the club) are the focus. Long term their plan is DA. On the boys side DA is a better league vs ECNL.

    Normally what happens is if a club does well at the younger DA years, they give them another year (older). That is the RSL/del Sol plan. And lets assume they grow over the next 4-5 years into all the DA age groups, ECNL (for RSL) will fall by the wayside.

    I have a friend at San Antonio whose kid plays DA. Every year I ask...what are you doing next year without DA. And since the club has done well...every year DA keeps giving them an older age bracket. Note: that certainly does not happen to all clubs. So it is no automatic thing. But recall...RSL is supported by...MLS RSL.

    The only reason...ONLY reason RSL and del Sol wants teams to do well in APL is so they can draw players into the club to add them (currently) to DA (del Sol or RSL) or ECNL (RSL). Those 2 leagues are where the "prestige" is.

    Now for 06 boys this year...remember this.

    At del Sol and RSL their top players are in DA.

    So the Classic team(s) played the B squad at del Sol at the 06 level. The RSL team you mention is AT LEAST the C squad for RSL. The top team is DA. The 2nd team is ECNL. Their 3rd team is APL They are NOT taking kids from DA or ECNL to prop up the APL or SL team next year. You don't take kids from your best teams to prop up the lower teams. The flow works the other way. The top teams pull from their lower teams AND ALWAYS from the best teams in other clubs.

    The talent over time at the younger years will flow to del Sol and RSL DA. The next option is ECNL which is RSL (currently...and likely to be lost when they go full DA), Rising and Arsenal here in the Valley, and FC Tucson in...Tucson.

    After that you have APL and SL..aka the minor leagues (sorry Tika).
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2019
  16. Tiki-Taka-Freak

    Tiki-Taka-Freak Active Member

    Minor leagues? Okay whatever man. Believe it or not there are players with families that can't meet the demands financially to play DA or ECNL. I know this because I have been in conversations with parents who came from both DA or ECNL who have their kids playing in APL, SL1, and SL2. Now are the ECNL or DA leagues supposed to be better? Yes. Is that true all the time? I would say no. When one watches the training with players that came from DA or ECNL and are now training with an APL team, it is easy to see there is very little distinction with the players as far as skill sets go. To equate it to "the minor leagues" is an exaggeration in my opinion. There are just too many factors that go into determining what player goes where and it isn't all based on talent alone.
    Weekendwarrior likes this.
  17. aginaz

    aginaz Active Member

    The DA/ECNL Kool-Aid is Strong!

    There are good kids in many other "minor leagues" as well. And there are average kids on some DA/ECNL teams too. There isn't a monopoly on talent or good coaching.
    05 AZ Soccer Dad likes this.
  18. Desert Hound

    Desert Hound Active Member

    There are some good players for sure in APL and other minor leagues.

    The APL and SL leagues however are weaker vs DA and ECNL leagues.

    The poster above was talking about the 06 APL for instance.

    The top team currently is del Sol. That is their 2nd team. 1st team is in DA
    The 2nd place team is Rising. That is their 2nd team. 1st team is in ECNL

    Over time more the of the best boy players in the Valley will flow into an ECNL or DA club.

    We saw it start to happen on the girls side with ECNL. Then we saw DA added 3 yrs ago. Today the overall quality of teams left in APL/SL are pretty weak.

    Go watch some ECNL or DA games. Then go watch an APL game. The difference in quality is noticeable.
    Tvaughn, al66, Soccer Dad and 2 others like this.
  19. whatithink

    whatithink Active Member

    From my understanding, ECNL is way more expensive than DA, because both RSL & Del Sol heavily subsidize their DA programs, which is what US Soccer wants them to do. DA, from what I've heard, is comparable with a state league team that goes to a couple of travel tournaments annually. I've even heard that its cheaper, on the girls side, than being on the DPL teams. All that is before any financial hardship scholarships parents might apply for with the clubs (or US Soccer).

    So, I get the statement for ECNL, but I don't think it stands up on the DA side. If a kid is good enough to make a starting 11 for DA, either club will make sure they can play and will deal with any financial issues the parent have.
    Desert Hound likes this.
  20. Sweeper

    Sweeper Active Member

    Costs of GIRLS DA, DPL and ECNL teams:

    SC Del Sol Girls DA teams - around $4400-4500 for the year. This does not include travel to get your child to games in CA, CO, FL, etc.
    SC Del Sol Girls DPL teams - around $3300-3500 for the year depending on the age group. This does not include travel to get your child to games in CA, TX, etc.
    Phoenix Rising Girls ECNL teams - around $3500-4200 for the year depending on the age group. This does not include travel to get your child to games in CA, NV, NJ
    Utah Royals Girls DA teams - around $2200-$2300 for the year depending on the age group. This DOES include travel since RSL subsides the travel cost. You will also see larger roster sizes on Utah Royals DA teams.

    Most APL teams will have training fees and team fees around $2000-2500 for the year depending on the age group. This does not include travel to get your child to games/tournaments out of state.
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2019
    Soccer Dad, Weekendwarrior and mbappe like this.

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